In his recent column for the Denver Post, Mark Moe, asks, “What can [high school students] learn? Higher-level skills such as critical, creative, and global thinking, not to mention that old-fashioned virtue currently being buried under the midden of standardized tests: wisdom. To Socrates, wisdom began in wonder, a state of mind CSAPs and their ilk neither encourage nor measure.
“So, in our haste to race to the top leaving no child behind, let's also consider that, as W.B. Yeats put it, ‘Education is not the filling of a pail; it is the lighting of a fire.’ The educational zeitgeist notwithstanding, we need to keep that fire alive.”
In your own words, explain what you think Moe believes an education should be. How should we be teaching our young people? What should they be learning? Then, connect this definition of an education to your own experience in high school (or more recently at DU if you’re not a first-year student). What has your educational experience been like? Has the wisdom been tested out of you? Have you felt overwhelmed by the pressure to succeed rather than empowered to learn and grow as a student and a person?
Post you response as a comment to this post before class on Monday. Aim for 250-350 words. I look forward to reading your response.
Part 1:
ReplyDeleteMoe considers himself an elitist (or hopes to be one); a competent, successful, educated person with a broad span of knowledge and higher-level thinking. Being a believer in elitism, Moe promotes this idea as a form of teaching. Tests, though useful at times, are generally nothing but quantitative “measures” of a student’s knowledge of a subject. I say “measures” because it is a debate as to whether or not this measurement is valid: Are the students simply cramming information into their brain just to regurgitate it back into the teacher’s hands? Or, are they truly absorbing and learning the subject at hand and developing a working knowledge of it? So, rather than administering an infinite, redundant slew of exams regarding simple skills, offer classes that challenge the student in a manner less common. In these classes, examine philosophy, ways to think about any given subject; provide a greater opportunity for students to develop more “global thinking skills,” as Moe puts it, than linear, single problem thinking.
Much of what Moe wishes to see in the educational system not only rests on administrators, but also on the teachers and students in the system. An Algebra 1 course may be just a class to pass for some students, but to another, it could be the first door creaking open to a whole world of wonder. The same can be said to biology, physics, language, humanities, and physical education. Most high school students are not in a mode of thinking 15 years down the line; what matters is their own performance now. What, I believe, is rarely realized and acted upon is that teachers maintain the responsibility to open a student’s mind and excite them about all the possibilities a simple Algebra 1 class can give them; to think farther ahead than one class. This one class is an introduction to one of the most common explanations of the physical world: math. This is not to say that a given student should only take one subject throughout their educational career, but that a certain course contributes to developing a higher level of thinking when combined with other classes of numerous studies. If the student has a vested interest in understanding the bigger picture and the instructor has a vested interest in providing students with opportunity to explore that bigger picture, there is nothing wrong with testing quantitatively. The student will be more interested in the material learned than the silly number that is thrown back at them once tested. By maintaining this “elite” interest in the surrounding world, it is near impossible to “test the wisdom out” of a person. I agree with Moe that extra seminars should be offered to students that explore non-traditional school material so as to broaden the view of students, however, only in conjunction with those classes designed to prepare and build the skills necessary to see and asses the greater world.
Part 2:
ReplyDeleteThe manner of education I explained above is very similar to much of my educational career. I attended a Montessori school, which is geared toward opening the minds of children to be able to think more globally. My high school was designed similarly. College level courses are different in that they become more specified. I went into college with a fairly solid idea of what I wanted to major and minor in and therefore already had the vested interest of learning the bigger picture of the subjects in which I participate. Although there have always been required classes, a majority of them have had some sort of underlying purpose to push the student to a new level of consideration. Of course, I have not always maintained a significant interest in every subject I have ever taken, however my teachers had always pushed for success not only in examination but in the actual learning process to approach higher levels (of any subject whether stemming from that particular class or otherwise). That being said, there have been certain classes where my single goal was to pass the class, and once passed, some is forgotten. In every school setting, there is pressure to succeed (from parents, teachers, friends, and the self), but, for me, this pressure has never been so much that I couldn’t handle it. Much of the pressure comes from me wanting to know and learn so much about the world and its different aspects so I can be a open minded person. Learning is a passion of mine, granted in some subjects more so than others, and the challenge to succeed is enjoyable to me. Maybe you consider an elitist now; I don’t know if that is good or bad, but what is important for me is to be well rounded and be able to consider many different aspects of the world we live in.
**Sorry about the 2 parts, not everything would fit into one posting.**
Mark Moe believes in a well rounded education; an education which will be carried on beyond the classroom. Moe agrees with W.B. Yeats statement, ‘Education is not the filling of a pail; it is the lighting of a fire’. My interpretation of this quote is that Moe sees education as not just a one time event. When a student studies for a test they often times just study the material need for the test, keep it in their brain until they have completed then test and then do not come back to the material ever again. When filling a pail, the water will eventually just run over the top and become lost in the earth, although when lighting a fire you must work to keep it alive and lit. Going back to the statement about studying for a test; filling a pail is like studying only the material on the test and forgetting it as soon as you have finished, lighting a fire is what Moe believes education should be like, when studying for a test the student should really understand the core of the material and work to keep it in their brains somehow for the rest of their lives. By doing this, the student will be creating wisdom. Through my own experience as a high school student I am often times just filling the pail. I usually cram for tests and study the bar minimum which is needed. Often times when trying to memorize definitions I only memorize the words in the definition rather than what the words are actually saying. Although, I have found out that when I truly do not understand a definition, talking about what the word really means, at its core, is very helpful and I can often keep the definition stuck in my head for much longer. If teachers stressed more to understand what things truly mean, and not just throw random definitions and facts at us, than us students would be more like lighting the fire.
ReplyDeleteBased on Moe’s article, he believes education is becoming to generalized and less stimulating for students. The example of his students staring out the window paying little to no attention to the lecture is a perfect example of this lack of stimulation and motivation. Teachers are beginning to teach to the tests, which eliminates all room for creativity in curriculums. They are forced to drill knowledge into student’s minds which, for many students, causes them to retain less. Class should be interesting and students should be motivated to learn. Hands on activities and connections to real world experiences are great ways to keep students enthused rather than textbook readings. Wisdom does not come from advanced calculus, wisdom is the ability to understand situations and be a contributing member of society. They should be learning subject matter that will benefit them in everyday situations. Obviously fundamentals such as math, English, basic sciences, and some level of history or geography are crucial to any student’s future success though.
ReplyDeleteW.B. Yeats’ statement, "Education is not the filling of a pail; it is the lighting of a fire," represents the true meaning of education well. Young people need to be passionate about what they’re learning. In order for the fire to be lit, teachers should be teaching in a manner that really inspires students to learn more and promotes the drive to learn. Nowadays educators feel the need to cram and force as much knowledge onto students even if they are not retaining the knowledge because their students test scores represent the school. Students strive to learn when they are taught in unique ways without pressure which provides them with a much more meaningful education experience.
In my high school experience, we were put under tremendous pressure, especially during sophomore and junior year. Some of my teachers felt obligated to teach to the SAT but many were the opposite and taught us more meaningful information. Although they taught in unorthodox ways, we still learned what we needed in order to be successful. Specifically, my calculus teacher senior year took three classes per term to teach us “life lessons”. These consisted of buying used cars, buying life insurance, investing money, and ethics. His lessons were incredibly interesting and they were meaningful. These types of lessons provided me with wisdom, not the fifteen page paper I had to write on Canada’s nationalism in history. Frequently I felt the need to succeed rather than the desire to learn but I had some teachers who were influential in the empowerment of learning over “filling of the pail”.
According to Moe, an education should be more about learning than success and good grades. His first argument is about the fact that the high school where he taught eliminated senior electives so that teachers could focus on the lower level classes whose successes and failures contribute to the overall success of the school. To the administration of the school, the classes that help them be a higher ranked institution are more important than those classes that don’t. This shows that it is not only the success of the students that is taking over learning it is also the success of the places where they learn. The other part of Moe’s argument comes from Socrates quote “wisdom began in wonder”. Moe believes that this side of education has been done away with because kids aren’t excited to learn when they go to school. They go to school because they have to in order to be accepted to the next level of learning. Moe agrees with Yeats and his statement, “Education is not the filling of a pail; it is the lighting of a fire”. The two statements from Socrates and Yeats go hand in hand with Moe’s views on learning. The student should be empowered to learn not just learn because they have to. My high school was similar to Moe’s views because it was a small all girls boarding school. The teachers all wanted us to succeed and get good grades so that we could get into good colleges but they also genuinely wanted us to learn to gain knowledge. Testing is definitely needed in institutions and is a good way to gauge where students are but I think that some people in my high school, myself included, would get so stressed about one test that it took a lot of the enjoyment out of learning. There was definitely pressure to succeed and move on to good universities but I don’t think that the pressure ever became overwhelming.
ReplyDeleteMoe believes that education should be more than rote memorization and the reciting of facts. He is certain that it is not enough to just achieve the test scores and numbers that will give the illusion that the student and his or her school are successful. Students should actually be learning things that are going to help them later in their life. The precise number of casualties in some obscure French war in the twelfth century is not going to greatly help the students to further their education and get a job. Moe suggests “critical, creative, and global thinking”, as well as other higher level skills (Moe). He takes a strong stance against how tests are being used today. According to Moe, tests should not be stressed so much. He has confidence that students who take tests and then stop there are not really accomplishing the end goal of education. The author can also demonstrate that people are always “anxious to discuss ideas, given a framework that engages them.” But it is education’s responsibility to stimulate people to actually use what they’ve learned and think, discuss, and share it.
ReplyDeleteMy personal experience with education has been varied. I have gone to both public and private schools, and I have had both terrible and amazing teachers. But the ones who made the lasting impact upon me and my peers were the ones who did exactly what Mark Moe did as he described in his article. The teachers who encouraged a classroom where people could be engaged in a discussion were the ones who actually made the best impressions on our academic careers, and maybe even our lives. The Socratic Method of Teaching is, from what I have experienced in my life thus far, the most successful way of engaging people’s minds. It required critical thinking and knowledge of the topic. Even spectators who are actually paying attention are going to gain immensely from such a discussion.
When techniques such as straight lecturing for hours on end are the only ways used to teach, I feel as though I am losing something rather than gaining knowledge. It does, in fact, seem as though some of the wisdom is being squeezed out of me and instead replaced by the monotonous voice of fact after fact read from a book by my eighty five year old AP history teacher. I have not felt very overwhelmed by the pressures that were exerted upon me to do well in all of my standardized tests, but I know that I did not benefit from the existence of these burdens.
In his article, Moe believes an education should be based off more than tests. Sure, tests are important in testing knowledge of a certain subject, but it does not hold students attention and reach beyond given answers to critical thinking. Moe showed that students will engage in a conversation about a subject that interests them. By getting rid of certain electives to focus on the success and higher test scores of other class, it eliminates student’s creativity and learning beyond textbooks and exams. He believes we should be teaching our young people through class interactions and intellectual discussions. Learning and education need to be based off more than taking exams. A student can read from a textbook and take notes and take a test over the material, but will that really be giving the student the knowledge he or she desires? Education should be taught in different and interesting ways in order to hold the students attention and allow them to understand the subject entirely. Moe believes that learning does not just stop when one graduates. Education continues throughout an individual’s entire life without taking tests. I went to a huge public school that had high expectations for student’s grade point average and sports. As a high school student I attained good grades but only did the bare minimum. I studied for tests and definitions that would appear but I never got the full grasp on the concept. I focused on passing the tests and could care less what I learning on the way. I think most students are in the same shoes I am. Why go above and beyond to learn about a subject if it won’t be on the test or matter with a final grade? I personally stress out about tests because it will affect my overall grade. I focus on succeeding over learning to grow as a student and individual. As a high school student, I didn’t see the point. While it is the student’s choice to choose whether or not he or she wants to do more than succeed academically, I believe it is the teachers responsibility to point the student in the right direction.
ReplyDeleteIn this article, Moe hits the nail right on the head with his view of an engaged education in high schools throughout the country. Students (including myself) often just do the bare minimum at the end of senior year, simply trying to pass courses instead of succeed. In my opinion, Moe thinks that an education should be more focused on the students understanding of the material and the deeper philosophy behind it than the scores pupils receive on standardized tests. The way our country has become so crazy about standardized testing makes it harder for students to really grasp material they are learning. Rather than teachers encouraging students to understand ideas and concepts they use, they are forcing memorization of equations and rules that will, hypothetically, make them do well on standardized tests. My education has been highly fixated on doing well on state-wide exams and possibly doing well enough on my SATs do go to college. Out of the 400 kids in my graduating class, only around 150 replied to a poll about where they were going to school this year. The kids that didn’t answer the poll either chose not to for various reasons, or aren’t going to college. For an inner-city school like mine, this was not unusual at all. I think this happens because of my school’s lackluster way of approaching education. I was never pushed to my limit in high school and was never encouraged to think outside of the standard three books we read in my writing class. A couple of teachers wanted to invigorate our writing program at my school, but the operation was shut down by the school board. After reading this article, I do not believe that the wisdom was “tested out of me” at all. I feel like I know so much, but not the type of subject matter I am tested on in school. I was definitely a victim of breaking under the constant pressure to do well in school instead of becoming a more well-rounded person by gaining knowledge outside of school.
ReplyDeleteAfter reading this excerpt, I think it’s clear that Moe believes education is found and acquired in wisdom. Instead of using the usual homework, quizzes, and standardized tests to measure education, society should begin to base education on personal experiences, creative thinking, and growth as a person. Mark Moe believes that education should not be limited to books and lectures inside the four walls of a school. He thinks that real world application and experimentation should be the basis of acquiring knowledge. I think that Yeats puts it perfectly when he states, “Education is not the filling of a pail; it is the lighting of a fire.” Nowadays, school seems to be a place where students are drowning in miscellaneous facts, dates, equations, theories, and ideas. In our present society, education and success are measured by grades that students receive rather than the information that they retain. In this sense, students are just “filling the pail”. Mark Moe believes that once students have a basis of knowledge in a certain field or idea, they should take that knowledge and apply it to real-life scenarios. By doing this, students will actually be learning the value of the information and how it pertains to real life. It is through this idea that students will obtain wisdom, which is the goal of education. When I was in High School, I felt a great pressure to get the perfect grades, perfect test scores, and ultimately acceptance to the perfect college. I would cram for tests and do homework last minute just to get the points for the assignments. By doing this I never really thought about the importance of the information I was memorizing, instead I just focused on doing whatever I could to get the best grades. I believe that the majority of students in our society have the same mindset as me. By having this mindset when it comes to education, students begin to value their grades more than the actual education they are receiving. I believe that if society applied Mark Moe’s ideas of education to school systems, students would begin to realize that their growth as a person outweighs the number they receive on their college entrance exams.
ReplyDeleteGrowing up in a school district where just getting kids to class was a big deal, education seemed to be different for every student. There were those who only went to class because they had to, and when they got there did nothing. Some students are just like that of the N.Y. Times debate of pressure, taking nothing but A.P. classes to get into good schools. Then, there were those who fell in between and just sort of did enough to get into a state school. So after being asked, “What should an education be?” the answer will surely vary. In my opinion their needs to be classes where students can go and be challenged to learn valuable skills. These skills also need to be diverse. A teenager who barely comes to class because he doesn’t care about calculus or chemistry clearly doesn’t want to be there, yet the school system requires him to stay and take certain courses. Why not enlist courses like woodshop and auto mechanics instead of dropping them. If you can’t keep children in school, at least give them something they might be interested in opposed to dropping classes because of budget constraints. As a student who participates more when he is interested in what is taking place, allow more students to be engaged in the classroom. Education is different for everyone. Some students may be challenged by difficult courses, while others aren’t cut out for that life and instead need to be taught art, mechanics, welding, and other challenging classes. As a student who never found my true calling in high school, I look forward to college as a time and a place to find my niche.
ReplyDeleteMark Moe is an educator who believes in an old fashioned way of thinking; a method that is often lost and not found in this day and age as we are all carried away in our everyday dull routine. The W.B. Yeats quote the author mentioned towards the end of the article directly correlates to the point Mr. Moe is trying to achieve: present day education has lost its track, and the ability to mold young minds has become more difficult. He says that it is possible to strike up some sort of conversation with young people, but only if you connect it with something that is relevant to their lives. I agree with what he says but at the same time, I disagree with what he says. Isn’t it difficult for adults to relate and understand things that the younger generations practice with ease everyday? I can tell you right now my parents cant grip half of the things I bring up that are relative this time. I know, Socrates is responsible for things that will relate to everyone who will ever walk this earth, but it’s still hard to grasp, especially when you have grown up with everything that was once so cherished at your fingertips.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Mr. Moe’s general idea and what he wants to accomplish, but at this point I feel it’s getting a bit unrealistic. Kids have grown up, been lulled to sleep in a false sense of security, and thus it has been much harder to educate them on things they have at their disposal. It’s not anyone’s fault, no one has control over it. Kids want to learn and study about things that are foreign to them, which is exactly what Socrates and the great philosophers of this world did. This generation will discover things that later generations will see as elementary, and they will discover things that generations after them will find as plain. It’s one of the many trends that’s will ascend through every generation.
“Education is not the filling of the pail; it is the lighting of a fire” sums it up, right then and there. Mark Moe of the Denver Post feels that education shouldn’t just be an attainment of requirements, or just “fitting the bill”. It should be a “lighting of fire”; education should spur on students’ desire to grow and experience new things, gain wisdom and insight. What good is education if it stops after school and doesn’t continue on through the years afterwards? In my musical education, I have learned that musicians should always be learning. My professor who plays in the Colorado Symphony Orchestra says that he is still learning, even after earning a professional career in his field! In my senior year humanities class, my teacher pushed us students to think deeply and effectively. Look beyond a grade and go for what really matters: learning! We debated as a class about issues that were controversial, wrote philosophical pieces of work, both of which helping us develop into more educated and aware citizens. More recently, in my musical studies at the Lamont School of Music, I think I’m being pushed in the correct direction. The pressure that I experience isn’t to “succeed” on standardized tests and the like. It is to be the best musician I can be, and to always grow musically. My curriculum is practice, practice, practice, in order to become a better percussionist. In practicing so much, I will refine my techniques and find more musical ways to play. In all actuality, who wants a non-musical musician?
ReplyDeleteMoe believes that education should be enjoyment, interesting and overall well rounded. We should be teaching students lessons and ideas that are going to take them somewhere in life. A lot of the time students will only study certain things for a test and then after the test it is erased from their memory. Instead of testing students so much, the education board should be looking at different methods to teach students. Personally, I am a procrastinator and usually leave all of my homework and studying until the last minute. After I am done writing the test, I usually forget a couple weeks after about what we learned. I usually learn better when I enjoy the material I am learning about. In high school there are a lot of pointless things they teach you. Instead, you could create different ways for students to learn that will actually help them. A lot of students drop out of school because they don’t like it. Instead of them dropping out why not offer classes that they truly do enjoy such as welding. Students will take the classes they find interesting and it will also teach them things that they would not have learned if they dropped out. Everyone is different and everyone has different interests. If you keep the students engaged and interactive, they will enjoy school more.
ReplyDeleteAfter I read the article, I think Moe believes that an education should be a system to improve student’s critical thinking skills, exercising student’s creative ability and also let the students have a broader eyesight. Education is not only based on test how high the students can get the score, it is also based on how the students really learn the materials. We should teach our young people how to solve a problem in our real world. Also, the students should learn something that is relate to their lives, not only about 1+1=2.
ReplyDeleteWhen I was in my high school, I have to learn nine subjects. They were: Chinese, English, Math, Chemistry, Biology, Physic, Geography, History and politic. Those nine subjects seem all relate to my life, but it that really relate? I only learned the subjects from the book, and memorize the words and numbers for my tests. I always thought about what I learned them for? only for test? I think so, because I always forget them when the tests finished. I remember my classmates always say that “The more you memorized the higher score you got”. We were not talking about understanding of our materials. In our high school, we almost had tests and a huge of homework everyday. We did not even have enough time to sleep. This was a big pressure for us. However, we have no choice. We have to do well on our exams. I do feel overwhelmed by the pressure to succeed rather than empowered to learned and grow as a student and a person. I have been in the U.S for almost three years for my college. I went to see the doctor when I back to China because of my pressure hurt my body. As an international student in the college, it is hard to learn with other native students. I have to do more works for my classes, because the test would never comes easier because of my nationality.
I have took a business law class on last quarter. I love the way the professor test on us. The test was open book and open internet. The test questions were all cases for multiple choices. It really relate our materials that we learned in class to our normal life. I think it is the good way for learning stuffs, and it also makes me feel more interesting when I was learning.
In this article, Moe believes that an education should be about learning and not testing for a grade. Moe states that by the time students are seniors in high school they no longer are engaged in their school work and just try to get by. By this time, a student does not even care to learn but to just graduate and move on with life. Moe believes that teaching should be through intellectual class discussions and not just teaching from the book and for tests. Testing is benefitting for learning in some ways but if you get an “A” does that mean you learned the material or just crammed for the test? Young people should be taught in a way that is intriguing for them to want to learn and not just memorize. Young students are capable of having mature group discussions but they need to be taught in a way that allows that. In high school I most definitely studied for the test in a few of my classes. Classes such as AP Biology is mostly learning from the text book and memorizing it cover to cover. Memorizing is one of my strengths as a student but I also do not try to forget the material once I learn it. Yes it is inevitable that when I cram for a test I will forget a chunk of material, but one of my goals as a student is to retain the information. I feel like society today has made students such as myself to take study to receive a high grade. As a student I personally feel like I have grown as a student by the work I have had in the past. I grew the most during assignments that were challenging for me such as long term papers and intense class discussions.
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